Europe. In or out?

[lymehoop]

This debate is going round in circles now - those arguments have been done to death. You'll see if you read back through the thread.

didn't LFW pull the plug on their In or Out thread, that's democracy for you, the Brexiters were winning hands down

[gaza09]

And I stand by my point. The man has blighted my life for years. Certainly he is intelligent ( he supports the R,'s) but he is arrogant and self seeking. I see the opportunities and positives for the future by embracing Europe and understanding our globalised inter- connected world. If your children have a mortgage, if they have investments, the uncertainty of a Brexit could be catastrophic. The legions of intelligent and informed economists who have given their view should not be ignored. The reason for high migration levels is our success. This is partly due to our membership of the EU. That's why they come . Leave and the jobs will go. For our kids as well. Please see sense on this.

You can still embrace Europe after we've left the European Union.
The reason for our success is that we are not in Euro zone or schengan travel area and we have highly skilled workers and the second largest financial sector in the world.
Compare that to Southern Europe and the joys the EU have brought to them.
Please see sense on this

[gaza09]

no wonder the youngsters are voting Remain if teachers like you are ramming this tripe down their throats day in, day OUT

Yep left wing dogma is rife in the teaching profession, it's why they hate Gove so much, he dared to stand up to them.

I think it's a case of a little less preaching and a little more teaching

[scuberry]

Switzerland FACTS
Not in the EU but still in Europe
Has its own tailored EU deal
Has free trade deals with the EU china,japan and many more
Exports 5k more to the EU than UK
Adopts 0% of EU rules
Has highest wages in Europe
2nd richest country in the world by nominal GDP per head
Ranks first in the world in the global innovation index
Doing rather well i think
NOT IN THE EU

Please see sense in this :o)

[Hubble]

Switzerland FACTS
Not in the EU but still in Europe
Has its own tailored EU deal
Has free trade deals with the EU china,japan and many more
Exports 5k more to the EU than UK
Adopts 0% of EU rules
Has highest wages in Europe
2nd richest country in the world by nominal GDP per head
Ranks first in the world in the global innovation index
Doing rather well i think
NOT IN THE EU

Please see sense in this :o)

Switzerland is so wildly different from the UK I don't think it's a viable comparison. They have a relatively small (relatively homogeneous) population, have benefited vastly from being the world's (often secret) bankers, stayed neutral in both world wars (and were allowed to partly for the previous reason) and therefore have nothing like the economic or social issues that are faced here. They are unique and privileged. Please don't tell me you think we could be like Switzerland? I think their democratic system of cantons is admirable, as is their relative stability, but it would be almost impossible for us (or anyone else for that matter) to emulate them. A Brexit won't make a blind bit of difference to us in that regard.

[bushkangaroo]

Need to stay in. But unfortunately I think 'Leave' will just do it, largely because of Boris Johnson's personal ambitions to lead the Conservative Party. He is trying to gain the job by distancing himself from Cameron, and because of his personal popularity thinks he will succeed sooner rather than later if we leave the EU, a not unreasonable belief. But it's unlikely to be good for Britain if we leave and will probably be harmful. At least UKIP might be dissolved soon enough, and that tw## of a leader will go back to being a nobody if we do leave, and that will be one good thing.

[lymehoop]

Need to stay in. But unfortunately I think 'Leave' will just do it, largely because of Boris Johnson's personal ambitions to lead the Conservative Party. He is trying to gain the job by distancing himself from Cameron, and because of his personal popularity thinks he will succeed sooner rather than later if we leave the EU, a not unreasonable belief. But it's unlikely to be good for Britain if we leave and will probably be harmful. At least UKIP might be dissolved soon enough, and that tw## of a leader will go back to being a nobody if we do leave, and that will be one good thing.

this is just personal and an insult to the millions who want Out. Many have no affinity to Johnson, Farage whoever. They just happen to share the same concerns as many of us do in the direction this EU monster is heading

[jmelanie]

Need to stay in. But unfortunately I think 'Leave' will just do it, largely because of Boris Johnson's personal ambitions to lead the Conservative Party. He is trying to gain the job by distancing himself from Cameron, and because of his personal popularity thinks he will succeed sooner rather than later if we leave the EU, a not unreasonable belief. But it's unlikely to be good for Britain if we leave and will probably be harmful. At least UKIP might be dissolved soon enough, and that tw## of a leader will go back to being a nobody if we do leave, and that will be one good thing.

Might as well say you want to stay in because you want Cameron to remain as prime minister. I actually don't think he will resign if we vote Brexit. It will be two years (probably) before the exit is completed. He has already said that he won't stand for the next election, so assume he will be resigning at the latest in 2018 or 2019.

[WeAreQPR12]

I really can't stand school teachers. Always talking about stress and their job. When you get them together they're fuc king worse and boring as. The fact it's geography all day every day, no wonder he wants to move into politics. All this moaning but enjoy your 7 weeks off during the summer and no wonder society is fu cked with his kind of influence

[dogsrrs]

I really can't stand school teachers. Always talking about stress and their job. When you get them together they're fuc king worse and boring as. The fact it's geography all day every day, no wonder he wants to move into politics. All this moaning but enjoy your 7 weeks off during the summer and no wonder society is fu cked with his kind of influence

The worse thing about them is their arrogance they know some their ranks are complete w@nkers yet they cover their backs and deny there is such thing as a bad teacher , they have their heads lodged so far up their asses preaching about how absolutely right they are , and call Gove repulsive for having the b@llox take them on

[bushkangaroo]

TBH, I'd like to see an independent Scotland, an independent Wales, and an independent NI (unless/until a majority of their population vote to unite with the rest of Ireland, and the voters in the Republic do the same). All of them staying in the EU. And I'd prefer an independent England also sticking within the EU! But I believe in democracy and if the majority of English voters don't want independence, and/or don't want it within the EU (not that it'll come to a vote in my lifetime I suppose), I'd accept that.

[bushkangaroo]

The Scots had their independence referendum, why can't the English?

[Hubble]

I feel something should be said in defence of teachers here! For many, possibly the majority, it is a deeply stressful job, dealing with ever more belligerent students and the ever-growing burden of red tape and testing. When my brother was teaching he rarely finished marking before 9.30pm most evenings and often had to work through his weekends to complete it and much of his holiday time was spent planning for the next term. Who among you giving them a hard time would be willing to work in an inner-city secondary school today? Sure, some may have a relatively easy time - but we all went to school, we all benefited (or not) from teachers. And the regime of testing and more testing enforced by subsequent governments makes things pretty grim for teachers and students alike these days. It is a very demanding job.

And for the record, I think Gove is a ####!

[maverick69]

TBH, I'd like to see an independent Scotland, an independent Wales, and an independent NI (unless/until a majority of their population vote to unite with the rest of Ireland, and the voters in the Republic do the same). All of them staying in the EU. And I'd prefer an independent England also sticking within the EU! But I believe in democracy and if the majority of English voters don't want independence, and/or don't want it within the EU (not that it'll come to a vote in my lifetime I suppose), I'd accept that.

NI is a very tough one.

I'm a bit Paddy (but first and foremost an Englishman) - and I think most up there want the province to be an independent country.

I also think that's the direction it's going.

In regards to Europe? It's gonna get very interesting.

If I hadn't submitted my books in 20 years, then I'd have fist up my bottom - and saying "Your honour"..............

[dogsrrs]

I feel something should be said in defence of teachers here! For many, possibly the majority, it is a deeply stressful job, dealing with ever more belligerent students and the ever-growing burden of red tape and testing. When my brother was teaching he rarely finished marking before 9.30pm most evenings and often had to work through his weekends to complete it and much of his holiday time was spent planning for the next term. Who among you giving them a hard time would be willing to work in an inner-city secondary school today? Sure, some may have a relatively easy time - but we all went to school, we all benefited (or not) from teachers. And the regime of testing and more testing enforced by subsequent governments makes things pretty grim for teachers and students alike these days. It is a very demanding job.

And for the record, I think Gove is a ####!

OK H where do you stand on teachers that are just not up to their job ? Also where do you stand on teachers who do their job well yet refuse to acknowledge there is such a thing as a useless teacher