100% OUT! Merkel is slowly but surely destroying Europe. If we don't take control of our borders we are finished. Remember once these "Refugees" get EU citizenship and Turkey gets the right to EU visas JIHAD will be free flowing into the Europe & the UK uncontrolled via Syria & the Middle East!
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Europe. In or out?
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Originally posted by lymehoop View Postprobably not Shania, for me it''s about losing our identity, bit by bit it's being chipped awayQPR
Best team in the world
Sort of
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Originally posted by vespa View PostWell for starters ,they are implementing the Trade Union reform bill ,trying to take away ,workers rights to withdraw labour ,i dont see them trying to tackle companies that break employment agreements . There is an ever increasing gap between the rich and the poor , with workers in insecure employment ,too scared to stand up for their rights , we are heading back to Victorian values .
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Originally posted by Hoop-du-Jour View PostHeading back to Victorian values whilst in the EU, what use it remaining then?Rangers,Scooters ,Tunes and Trainers
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Originally posted by vespa View PostTo be honest ,thats my problem , i dont know whether the EU is trying to keep the Torys in check or whether they are part of the problem ! When ive worked that one out ,i`ll know which way to vote .
It's all about opinions and personal experience I suppose and that's just mine. Vote how you will, I doubt much will change down on the bottom rungs of the ladder whatever is decided, shite always obeys gravity
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Originally posted by gaza09 View PostVery true, best not to believe a word any of them say. What it all boils down to is do you wish to pool sovereignty with 27 other nations to provide us with stronger trading power. Or do you wish for us to be governed solely by our parliament and courts of law, with our sole interests at heart.
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Originally posted by Itsonlyagame View PostThats what it boils down to.
Vote on what we're led to believe, by people who nearly always have their own agenda or are basing their opinions on supposition. Or vote on the facts as we know them. Leaving means we're not dictated to by unelected EU officials and we will have more power to control our borders.
As has been said, it's the low paid and construction workers in particular who have suffered the most. Your average middle class family are loving it. Cheaper extensions/loft conversions and their houses cleaned and ridiculously named children cared for by someone who charges peanuts. No disrespect to anybody who comes to Britain for a better life, in fact hats off to them for having the gumption to do it. At some point however, infrastructure can't cope and in this climate of savage cuts to schools, social housing and the NHS, a line has to be drawn.
Out.
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^^Rubbish, the middle class aren't the winners here, it's the top 5% or so who are doing well off this. Cheap labour and more potential customers. Everyone else is worse off than 10 years ago, and this is a global thing, not just here.
I think we're ####ed either way tbh. Labour are finished here for the foreseeable future and when they do get into power it will be New Labour / Blair mark 2. So if we leave the Tories will be shaping the country. On the other hand the EU is a basket case./
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This wont interest most on here (it is aimed at generally left voters but it may interest right voters who would like a different perspective) but its a debate that I attended recently. EU/Europe Debate on the Left - In or Out ? With Caroline Lucas & Tom Hickey. It was hosted at Brighton uni which is renowned for being very leftist hence the reason for it being aimed towards left voters. The 2 people involved are Caroline Lucas (MP for Brighton, Green party Honcho etc etc) and Tom Hickey (a good friend, senior lecturer at Brighton uni in politics and philosophy, staunch socialist and keen on leaving the EU). It is an hour long so be prepared. Enjoy.....or not if you're not a "loony lefty"
Last edited by Hove Ranger; 23-05-2016, 02:38 PM.
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Originally posted by FACTS View Post^^Rubbish, the middle class aren't the winners here, it's the top 5% or so who are doing well off this. Cheap labour and more potential customers. Everyone else is worse off than 10 years ago, and this is a global thing, not just here.
I think we're ####ed either way tbh. Labour are finished here for the foreseeable future and when they do get into power it will be New Labour / Blair mark 2. So if we leave the Tories will be shaping the country. On the other hand the EU is a basket case./
So your average middle class homeowner who decides to have an extension built doesn't benefit from the huge influx of Eastern European labour which has swamped the building trade. Not only has this influx driven down labour costs, Eastern European builders are more inclined to accept huge amounts of cash for their services thus saving the punter even more money in tax. Or the fact that the vast majority of nannies and cleaners are also now Eastern European for the same reasons. Those are the facts FACTS.“He'll regret it till his dying day, if ever he lives that long”
Will Danaher
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Originally posted by Itsonlyagame View PostRubbish eh ?
So your average middle class homeowner who decides to have an extension built doesn't benefit from the huge influx of Eastern European labour which has swamped the building trade. Not only has this influx driven down labour costs, Eastern European builders are more inclined to accept huge amounts of cash for their services thus saving the punter even more money in tax. Or the fact that the vast majority of nannies and cleaners are also now Eastern European for the same reasons. Those are the facts FACTS.
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Originally posted by Itsonlyagame View PostRubbish eh ?
So your average middle class homeowner who decides to have an extension built doesn't benefit from the huge influx of Eastern European labour which has swamped the building trade. Not only has this influx driven down labour costs, Eastern European builders are more inclined to accept huge amounts of cash for their services thus saving the punter even more money in tax. Or the fact that the vast majority of nannies and cleaners are also now Eastern European for the same reasons. Those are the facts FACTS.
Maybe we've got different ideas about what 'middle class' means. It's not the guy who gets a cleaner to come round for 2 hours a week who is winning, it's the guy that owns a cleaning company who has 50 of them on contracts.
The middle class of 10, 15, 20 years ago are worse off now than they were. ?Their taxes go towards the EU the same as anyone, in fact they prob pay MUCH more tax than they did then, plus prices have risen a lot.. It's the truly rich that have got richer, and this is a GLOBAL pattern, happening inside and outside the EU.
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