The thread to end all threads about Koreans following particular football players

[vblockranger]

No, if he plays poorly then no problem, in context. Doesn't matter where he's from. Though Park clearly is not a rubbish player per se, just hasn't been much good for us (so far), but that's another topic.

What I am saying is that, even in a thread that has nothing to do with player performances, but is discussing cultural differences (which was originated by an individual who was trying to help us understand their mindset better, and in which we have responded rightfully to help him understand ours), you still manage to slip in a negative comment about Park. It's almost as if you are actually not interested at all in improving relations with our new Korean fans, who have rightfully or wrongfully (and for what it's worth I agree that they also need to understand our culture - and the dog**** thread was a good example of that) taken offence at some of our posts - and just want to continue to antagonise.

May not be what you are doing it all, but it does 'appear' like that, to me at least. I just don't see the point.

Not what i am doing at all, not on purpose anyway.

[bonheurjh]

Oh, actually ######## is quite universally used to describe the same in the USA as well. I am well aware of its use in that context. As I posted above and again to vblockranger, I qualified it by saying that "if the poster knew about the sensitivity of the word before posting". vblock says he did not know. I will take his word for it.

However, if someone, English or not, knew its sensitivity to Koreans and used it anyway, it would have been racist, wouldn't you agree?

Joon, I like you and I would like you to just let it slide at times.

Sometimes, time solves things for you

a turning point will be the medicine for all; if QPR wins and if Park does perform undeniably well.

I think most here read your sound post

[MYU]

Snaxo says: "May not be what you are doing it all, but it does 'appear' like that, to me at least. I just don't see the point."

Exactly how I see it.

[Joon]

Nope, since this isnt a korean forum. Now if Vblock was to go on a korean forum and say something along the lines of 'You are all ########' then i could understand you all not being too happy.

Come on. You know that is illogical and absolutely incorrect. You just choose to say that so you can just bury the matter.

Let's take the same example and flip it over. Let's say you were a black man, and I became upset with you here, so I went to the Korean football forum and posted and "Oh that n***** ****ed me off", that would not be a racist remark because it's not an English forum? Bull crap.

When a word has multiple meanings, one of which could be racist, it is entirely in how the writer or speaker intended to use that particular word that makes it a racist remark or not. Not whether the forum is primarily an English language or Korean language forum.

Bon, I know you mean well. And yes, time fixes some things. But not all things.

[vblockranger]

Probably not anymore in this particular thread, because you would just be saying it out of spite. It really depends on what you are thinking of as you say or write it. After all, racism often burns within, sometimes without the person even realizing it.

However, let's take take a similar, more severe word. Yes, the n word. If you did not know the malignant context involved with the word and called a black man by that word, you may not have been racist in saying so. Let's say you got a rough education on the definition of that word. If you used the same word thereafter, would it be racist or not? Answer is, it's what you're feeling inside when you are saying it.

thats a good point about the N word. I hear it used a lot on the TV and in music. Even hear it used on the streets between the same ethnicity. I have never used the word myself actually and never would i dont think. I can assure you that when i use the term Dogsh1t there in no racial undertones present within me and there is also no racial undertones when i post in response to any Korean or whatever nationality on the MB

[SammyKojoe]

As I said, "if the poster (in this case, you) knew the sensitivity of the word before using it", it would have been a racist comment. But as I also said, it was not clear to me whether you knew the context before you used it, so I did NOT reply to that post nor did I call you a racist over it.

Where you are from yes. But not here fella. This is an English/UK forum. Which you have every right to visit and be a part of. But in doing so you should adhere to the cultures/terms and expressions that are normal in the country the forum originates. As V block would if he posted in a Korean forum when Rob Hulse makes his move to Korea. If you don't like what is said on here, you have the freedom not to to visit and see these terms that would be deemed racist and offensive in your country. You have that choice. This is not a Korean forum. You would do well to remember that.

*Notes speech for future Mod application*

[Norths]

Come on. You know that is illogical and absolutely incorrect. You just choose to say that so you can just bury the matter.

Let's take the same example and flip it over. Let's say you were a black man, and I became upset with you here, so I went to the Korean football forum and posted and "Oh that n***** ****ed me off", that would not be a racist remark because it's not an English forum? Bull crap, sir.

When a word has multiple meanings, one of which could be racist, it is entirely in how the writer or speaker intended to use that particular word that makes it a racist remark or not. Not whether the forum is primarily an English language or Korean language forum.

Bon, I know you mean well. And yes, time fixes some things. But not all things.

The N word is a universal term that is racist in all cultures, everyone knows that and there is no denying that. I find it disgraceful that you're even comparing the two words if I am honest. A word that is linked to slavery against one that has been used to describe the performance of a player.

[MYU]

thats a good point about the N word. I hear it used a lot on the TV and in music. Even hear it used on the streets between the same ethnicity. I have never used the word myself actually and never would i dont think. I can assure you that when i use the term Dogsh1t there in no racial undertones present within me and there is also no racial undertones when i post in response to any Korean or whatever nationality on the MB

Just don't use the word again on this forum, cheers.

[Norths]

Just don't use the word again on this forum, cheers.

Just to be clear MYU, we are being asked/told which words we can and cant use?

[vblockranger]

Just don't use the word again on this forum, cheers.

lol so the word dog**** is banned on this forum? lets be very clear

[vblockranger]

how about just the word dog?

[Joon]

The N word is a universal term that is racist in all cultures, everyone knows that and there is no denying that. I find it disgraceful that you're even comparing the two words if I am honest. A word that is linked to slavery against one that has been used to describe the performance of a player.

Disgraceful, you say? I did qualify my post by saying it is a more extreme scenario that I am using to illustrate a point.

Let me take it on the opposite extreme to prove it to you. Let's say you met me on the street somewhere, and you didn't like Koreans in general, so when you met me and I was wearing a Park jersey, you loudly yell at me, "hey, Korean!!!!!!!" with all the malignant racist intent burning within you. The word itself, Korean, is of course absolutely not racist by definition. But your utterance would have been a racist remark nonetheless, because you meant it to be demeaning.

I'll use a similar example. If you're are an Englishman and you go to Korea and someone with a sneer on his face yells at you "y*nkieee!!!!" believe me when I tell you, that is a racist remark.

This is why it's all about intent when it comes to speech and racism.

[SammyKojoe]

Just don't use the word again on this forum, cheers.

Find that amusing since the Mod Brighton R deemed nothing wrong with the term when it was used in its original context?

[vblockranger]

Disgraceful, you say? I did qualify my post by saying it is a more extreme scenario that I am using to illustrate a point.

Let me take it on the opposite extreme to prove it to you. Let's say you met me on the street somewhere, and you didn't like Koreans in general, so when you met me and I was wearing a Park jersey, you loudly yell at me, "hey, Korean!!!!!!!" with all the malignant racist intent burning within you. The word itself, Korean, is of course absolutely not racist by definition. But your utterance would have been a racist remark nonetheless, because you meant it to be demeaning.

I'll use a similar example. If you're are an Englishman and you go to Korea and someone with a sneer on his face yells at you "****eeeeee!!!!" believe me when I tell you, that is a racist remark.

This is why it's all about intent when it comes to speech and racism.

But why would any of this happen? there has been no racist reports when Koreans or anyone else has visited the ground? And i stress using the word dog**** is not a racist comment in this country and is not used with racial undertones in any post present on this forum. Why do you see racism when there isnt any? i think its a weakness in certain cultures (and no i am not being racist...sigh)

[Snaxo]

Whilst these are valid points Joon, realistically, it's not really rightfully enforceable on an internet forum as you can't easily prove one way or another whether that intent is there - unless it's blatant. For one thing, there is no opportunity to asses facial expression, tone of voice and body language. And it's fair to say, as a general comment, written communication is not a strength for some people and written words can easily be misinterpreted.