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"Within Your Means" premiership and QPR

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  • "Within Your Means" premiership and QPR

    Are we better or worse than the club who got promoted last season..?

    I hear rumours that we are 50 million in debt, I really doubt that is true !! Would expect it to be far less.

    Blackpool
    Owners Owen Oyston (76.3%), Valery Belokon (20%)

    These figures from Blackpool’s promotion season show how far the Seasiders gambled – as other Championship clubs do - on climbing up into the Premier League money pot. Valery Belokon, a Latvian industrialist, paid £4.5m in 2006 for 20% of Blackpool, which has long been owned and bankrolled by publisher Owen Oyston, and run by his son, Karl. Although credited with doing so shrewdly, and avoiding paying agents, Blackpool ran a wage bill 144% of the club’s total income, making a £7m loss. Had they not won promotion, the club could have run into difficulties, but Ian Holloway and his team hit the jackpot

    60% by the chairman, Jeremy Peace, 10.4% by Geoff Hale
    WBA

    Considered to be a well-run club which has made its peace with yo-yoing, trying to stay in the Premier League without overstretching financially to do so. These figures are for last season’s promotion, in which West Brom cut the wage bill, keeping it at £23m, huge for the Championship, with the benefit of parachute payments and managed to go up comfortably. The club has very little debt, and a good season staying up this year will have greatly improved their financial position.

    Mike Ashley owns Newcastle United via his company, St James Holdings Limited
    Newcastle

    These are the figures from Newcastle’s promotion season; with turnover halved, the club kept a huge wage bill for the Championship and finished top, 23 points clear of third place. Hapless Mike Ashley has found himself vilified for awful decisions and an absence of grace, yet he has put £140m in interest free loans into Newcastle. With St James Park’s 52,000 capacity, the third biggest in English football. The club also has the £35m from selling Andy Carroll and fans wait to see if Ashley is prepared and able to see it spent wisely this summer on reinforcing the squad.

    Interesting stuff regards Fulham, who we seem to want to compare ourselves with, they have one of the largest debts

    The £187m he has loaned interest free to embed the club at Craven Cottage and finance its rise from the bottom division to the Premier League has belied the early expectation that he would cash in. At Fulham they proudly cite him as the longest-serving “foreign” owner of a Premier League club. Still complains about players’ wages draining clubs, and argues that only BSkyB actually make money out of the Premier League, but with Harrods sold to the Qatari ruling dynasty for £1.5bn last year, Al Fayed shows no sign of withdrawing. Fulham would be nowhere near the Premier League, and probably not at Craven Cottage, were it not for the indulgence of their owner, so their fortunes depend on his continued enthusiasm

    Ownership Mafco Holdings Limited, a Bermuda (tax haven) company, which is owned by Mohamed Al Fayed and his family
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  • #2
    Worse...I refuse to read that ******** Pete. We are worse off...I know it, you know it...the dogs in the street know it.

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    • #3
      All those clubs own their own stadium bar Fulham who, I agree, are a financial basket case. Fulham are the most similar. Blackpool are now stable, West Brom too and Newcastle have the clout and the fanbase to pull through whatever Ashley does.

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      • #4

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        • #5
          David Conn or David Lacey?

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          • #6
            I was actually quite interested to read the factual stuff.

            No spin whatsover, though guess I'll wait for someone to portray it as such
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            • #7
              The spin was you saying that you doubt our debt is as high as £50m! Don't tell me Gianni wrote that in error onto our balance sheet! Surely our balance sheet is a factamondo?

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              • #8
                Was that after or before we got promoted to the Premiership?
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                • #9
                  You can't measure our debt at the moment, as it's not true debt as our guaranteed earnings out weigh this over the next 4 years even if we do go down. 50 million could easily be possible based on annual loses and mis management, but it can't be taken as debt like other business's.

                  If it's as high as that it's making a mockery of the jokers asking top money for a club where the stadium needs to be addresses and invested in massively if we are to progress as a premier league club. If we can redevelop loftus road we could be looking at 200 million cost, of course this could generate huge sponsorship, council events, converts and improved corporate revenue and much higher ticket sales but match day costs would also be higher.


                  It would be many years before owners saw return inninvestment if ever

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                  • #10
                    Meant if we can't develop loftus road

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by qblockpete View Post
                      Was that after or before we got promoted to the Premiership?
                      The club needs further investment to survive in the PL and Director's loans are very tax efficient for all concerned, I doubt they have been repaid, but of course I genuinely hope that debt has been reduced, and the ABC/Sarita loan secured on LR is repaid in particular!

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                      • #12
                        I should also add that as a balance sheet is only ever a snapshot of what a company is worth on 1 particular day of the year and our board tend not to disclose anything that they don't have to legally or is not of benefit to them, that we are unlikely to discover the true position either!

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Nodge70 View Post
                          All those clubs own their own stadium bar Fulham who, I agree, are a financial basket case. Fulham are the most similar. Blackpool are now stable, West Brom too and Newcastle have the clout and the fanbase to pull through whatever Ashley does.
                          We own ours don't we?.....Serious question!...I thought we did!!

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                          • #14
                            I thought the most recent suggestion was that we'd lost £13.4M last season, so are now about £37 million in debt, not £50m.

                            The £50m figure was mentioned as a guesstimate for the end of next season assuming we lost the same amount, which may not happen and would be affected by -
                            Increase in players wages, bonus's for achieving promotion to Prem
                            Transfers in, will undoubtedly be more than transfers out ! (I hope)
                            Improvement works to the Ground
                            Increased S/T and Matchday prices
                            Increased TV revenue
                            Increased Sponsorship

                            At least, that's how I read it. I could be wrong.
                            Maybe The Club will be more transparant now we're a Premiership side ?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by qblockpete View Post
                              Are we better or worse than the club who got promoted last season..?

                              I hear rumours that we are 50 million in debt, I really doubt that is true !! Would expect it to be far less.
                              Not much rumour in that figure Pete.

                              The last set of accounts were to May 2010 and on page 7 you will see a loss of £13,698,000 for that year and on page 10 you can see the net current liabilities (debt) at £36,362,000

                              - QPR 1951-52: Enlarged Photo - Throughout the day, updates, comments and perspectives re QPR and football in general are posted and discus...


                              Those are the last set of accounts May09-May10 FACT not rumour. Last seasons have yet to be submitted, but it saw us bring in a variety of loan and permi signings. If last season saw the same loss then the current debt before going into the Premier League would be:-

                              £13.7m + £36.3m = £50m

                              Oh, and throw in another £1m for the FA fine and expenses!!

                              Clearly last seasons loss is anyones guess but doubt it would be less than the one before in these accounts.

                              As I said not too much rumour in that figure, it's pretty accurate in my opinion

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