Statement Change of rule (18-11-2010)

[Toni German]

Oh my days.

Have you ever thought of becoming a traffic warden or a steward?

I was a Police Officer for 10 years, does that count?

FFS I'm trying to do you guys a favour before the site gets reported for Click Fraud.

[jfish]

I was a Police Officer for 10 years, does that count?

FFS I'm trying to do you guys a favour before the site gets reported for Click Fraud.

I think your on a windup.... You got me

[Toni German]

I think your on a windup.... You got me

No wind-up.

[Bluehoop]

Click Fraud occurs where generic computerised systems or human counter-parts are put in place solely to generate money by visiting websites with Click Ads for no reason other than to click them. If they are provided to purposeful websites such as WATRB and the people clicking on them are here to view for the primary purpose of contributing to the site then usage does not fall within the fraudulent act said to have been committed in 2 Jurisdictions in the USA under the laws of the specific states concerned. People (human beings with a sound mind - so most on here qualify) who come on this site to talk about Rangers are at liberty to make an informed choice of whether to click or not, some will, some won't - and purely by the act of marketing, at least one person will be affected by the message they view, in terms of a sales and market perception of the advertised product. Unless the individuals concerned in hosting the site have set up the aforementioned generic "clickers" or are deliberately directing traffic to the site with the sole intention of clicking then you are barking up the wrong tree.
Furthermore, the Wiki thread you posted up is the interpretation of the individual concerned with the article and not a matter of fact. Nor is it in any way applicable under English law.

[WeAreQPR12]

Toni tell me you didn't get all that info from Wiki??? Your better than that mate.

[Toni German]

It's a Common Law offence. The abolition of conpiracy as a specific offence under C.L.A 1977 has no effect.

http://legal.practitioner.com/regulation/standards_9_3_23.htm

Anyway, I've had enough of this now. I've given my advice for the benefit of the site, it's up to them to decide what to do. Only trying to preserve WATRB as it's one of my favourite sites.

[Bluehoop]

It's a Common Law offence. The abolition of conpiracy as a specific offence under C.L.A 1977 has no effect.

http://legal.practitioner.com/regulation/standards_9_3_23.htm

Anyway, I've had enough of this now. I've given my advice for the benefit of the site, it's up to them to decide what to do. Only trying to preserve WATRB as it's one of my favourite sites.

Click fraud per se may be (and almost certainly would be found to be) a common law offence, however the definition of the fraudulent act is wholly at odds with what takes place on this and many thousands of other sites. You cannot be guilty of an offence, under common law or any other act of parliament, unless you are in fact committing said offence in the first place. I think the saying is "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing" - but maybe the sites owners should consult their lawyers - what rate did you suggest earlier - about £100 ph? More like £500 for the appropriate specialist I imagine

[QPR1234]

tbh i get what this sites trying to achieve..

but i havent and wont click the adverts.

i give my bit to charity when i choose to. i dont appreciate being spammed to help.

i say spammed because all i see is peoples sigs with those video ads in.. okay thats fine but i know for a fact that only people wish to help the advertising can get sigs which contain pictures and videos etc.

[Toni German]

tbh i get what this sites trying to achieve..

but i havent and wont click the adverts.

i give my bit to charity when i choose to. i dont appreciate being spammed to help.

i say spammed because all i see is peoples sigs with those video ads in.. okay thats fine but i know for a fact that only people wish to help the advertising can get sigs which contain pictures and videos etc.

I agree.

I have Leukaemia and I raised £7.5k for the charity Leukaemia Care by organising a charity poker tournament amongst other things.

Can't WATRB be a bit more imaginative? I know the site needs money to cover costs but just asking people to blindly click on ads that have no interest to them................surely there is a better way?

[Jeffro]

But is connolly starting Saturday?

[qblockpete]

End of the day, we are not making anyone click, but its nice to have a £20 time of first goalscorer or others for guess the crowd. Happy not to do them,. but it only takes a minute to click and we can.

Other sites have adverts on top of their sites and nothing goes back to fans at all.

Clearly up to posters if they wish click or not

[Toni German]

End of the day, we are not making anyone click, but its nice to have a £20 time of first goalscorer or others for guess the crowd. Happy not to do them,. but it only takes a minute to click and we can.

Other sites have adverts on top of their sites and nothing goes back to fans at all.

Clearly up to posters if they wish click or not

You're missing the point Pete.

What you do with the money is irrelevant. And of course we have our own free will.

It's the constant, unrelenting, begging pleas to click on the adverts that's the problem. And don't say you're not pleading - just look at the posts over the last few months and certain posters signatures.

[MYU]

To stop some confusion I have copy & pasted two emails sent in from the video advert company and as you will see they are answering my question and it's date 24 April 2010. They have seen the adverts placed on this website with our text and pleased to see it at the top of this website. Everything we have done and placed on this site, the video company are 100% aware of. The only thing they do NOT allow is using robots to generate clicks, which we don't do.

Hi MYU,
There is no catch and we are a completely genuine Company.
You will earn revenue each time one of your visitors clicks to play the video and most campaigns pay for UK plays only and there is no financial outlay. The video doesn't have to be played all the way through, just a click and it doesn't have to be unique visitors. The Video Player looks good anyway and the size of the player is customisable. I have included a link below so you can see the Ad and also a couple of example sites that are running it. By editorial posts we mean something like a couple of lines or more, that will direct the viewer to the video. You always choose if you want to run the Ad and where to place it. The better the position, the more revenue you earn ie home page etc.

This email below was posted to me on the 15-05-2010

What you do is your Business and your members have their own free will. Nobody is forced to click on a video and I can see you that you run other Ads alongside ours.
Sounds like jealousy and bullying to me, as you are not taking any money from the punters and carrying Ads has always been something that independent football sites and forums have always engaged in successfully. I would send any moaners the examples I sent you to show them this is this case.
Most independent Sites do have to find some way of maintaining their site costs.
As I said you are doing well.
Cheers,

We were donating 100% of the video clicks to our two charities which you will see on the link below with payments made for you all to see but it don't get many views. I thought donating money as a group of fans would be a great idea.

We have now decided to offer you the incentive and give you the members 50% and our charity 50% of the income, it's only fair because you are the ones who generate the funds.

100% of clicks from the home page video goes directly into another pot for members of this site to win but that's only if they offer is a good special deal.

Last month W12pHilOsOPher won 2 tickets to the Cardiff game from this very website, where do you think the money came from and remember we don't generate enough funds to cover the cost of this site each month.

We'd like to offer more chances for you to win money & prizes without having you the members to pay a fee for this site, how could we do this without charging or by proving these video adverts which cost you nothing to click?

One thing I'm 100% sure about is that everyone enjoys entering our competitions and the two charities welcome our donations, we would like this to continue and can only do this with your input.

We will always remain a free website, we also want to offer donations to both QPR in the community & Kiyan Prince Foundation as well as offer our members with good competition prizes.

Any new ideas are welcome.

[Quaz]

why don't you wind your neck in, try pm'ing MYU and ask him what the situation is instead of being a complete, well i can't say as i am mod.

Try asking him whether he is doing it off his own back ( extra clicks ) or possible CHECKED with the companies already about the do's and don'ts.

Legal background or not there are better ways of doing things, think before you type would be a good bit of advice.

[Toni German]

Why?

It concerns me that you appear to be ripping off your advertisers by advocating multi-clicks on an advert, yet appear not to acknowledge that what you are doing is wrong. I would have thought an open discussion is better than sneaky little private messages. Or have I hit a nerve cos you actually know it's wrong?