Vine Seems Not Happy

[acricketer]

Vine isn't doing himself any favours with his attitude. His reputation will go before him in the future.

From a contract point of view, the club has come unstuck. Vine is an employee with a pay agreement for a set timeframe. He will only move if it benefits him. As has been mentioned above, it is up to the club to negotiate the separation agreement.

[qblockpete]

Look, at the end of the day length of contract is not the issue, don't see many ciriticising mackie being on 4 years and this is not a defence of any one in particular.

At the time Vine was viewed as a great signing from birmingham even more so than Mackie from Plymouth, it just suits arguments to say contract was too long.

Vine should go out and play first team football, he loves the game so much. admittedly, he is probably on too much to make that feasible so maybe arguing he on too much is a better argument than saying its the length of contract, but he did come from the premiership

[WeAreQPR12]

don't forget GP is pulling Pete's strings Benny.

[qblockpete]

Benny

You argument is flawed

Hall is club captain under Warnock and Mackie is on 4 years. How long is Clarke on for example in terms of contract terms? Helguson has proven he is a good player and the only player that might have too long a contract is Ageymang, cannot say that about Vine because if he hadn't broke his leg, he will be in our first team now. Trouble is, he is acting like he is still a good player, when clearly he is only good at waving his arms.

The club should always look to build and go up, if you have a player on 2 years (example), he can demand much more later if his contract is coming to an end.

[WeAreQPR12]

yeah good post Pete to be fair.

[BennyBoyRs]

Benny

You argument is flawed

Hall is club captain under Warnock and Mackie is on 4 years. How long is Clarke on for example in terms of contract terms? Helguson has proven he is a good player and the only player that might have too long a contract is Ageymang, cannot say that about Vine because if he hadn't broke his leg, he will be in our first team now. Trouble is, he is acting like he is still a good player, when clearly he is only good at waving his arms.

The club should always look to build and go up, if you have a player on 2 years (example), he can demand much more later if his contract is coming to an end.

Yes Pete...It's really flawed.

Only NW can answer why he made the mistake of giving One Game Fitz Hall the armband as he's not only a liability, but also a crock who'll not get back in the side all the time Gorkss and Connolly are fit. Mackie on 4 years is fine as it was NW's choice of signing, whereas Vine wasn't any managers choice. In any case, no one is bemoaning Vine's long contract here as he was a good sighning. This whole arguement, if you care to take your defensive head from out of your anal passage, came from a poster saying it's Vine's fault. Nodge meerly pointed out that he didn't offer homself a 4 year deal on a silly wage, did he?

We've had PLENTY of shocking signings between GP being given the rights and NW stopping them. Everything from now on, including Mackie is down to NW and I can trust that as he knows exactly what's needed.

Flawed, or just not as one-sided as your views?

Just wondered

[qblockpete]

How many players did Neil Warnock ask the board to sell this summer, if all those players are that bad?

Just wondered

[ChelmsfordRs]

Yes Pete...It's really flawed.

Only NW can answer why he made the mistake of giving One Game Fitz Hall the armband as he's not only a liability, but also a crock who'll not get back in the side all the time Gorkss and Connolly are fit. Mackie on 4 years is fine as it was NW's choice of signing, whereas Vine wasn't any managers choice. In any case, no one is bemoaning Vine's long contract here as he was a good sighning.

Apart from this comment which started the whole tangent from Vine to GP

Just who is the Joey who dished him a 4 year contract on crackin dosh and probably picking up win bonuses an all?

We've had PLENTY of shocking signings between GP being given the rights and NW stopping them.

What players are you referring to ? Im not saying we haven't had some cr*p players in the last few years I just wondered which ones you were specifically blaming GP for ?

[Nodge70]

How many players did Neil Warnock ask the board to sell this summer, if all those players are that bad?

Just wondered

I think he made it pretty clear that certain players would be allowed to leave should a suitable offer be received.

I know that is slightly different but eggs is eggs.

Also to be fair to Benny, many many supporters expressed bewilderment at the 4 year deals given to Hall, Agyemang and Vine at the time they were signed, especially on the sums of money reported. I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but these were not good deals at the time and they are now terrible deals proving to be a bit of a mill stone.

[qblockpete]

True, but many were questioning on this very board about the 4 years given to Mackie.

You cannot have your cake and eat it. At the time Vine was a very good buy.

The only player I remember being questioned back In Jan 2008 about a 4 year deal was Ageymang, then a few months later he scored 7 goals in 8 games. Conveniently for some the arguments surrounding Helguson have all been forgotten

Football is a funny old game

I wouldn't be blaming Warnock if Leon Clarke gamble did not pay off

[sirpiechucker]

True, but many were questioning on this very board about the 4 years given to Mackie.

You cannot have your cake and eat it. At the time Vine was a very good buy.

The only player I remember being questioned back In Jan 2008 about a 4 year deal was Ageymang, then a few months later he scored 7 goals in 8 games. Conveniently for some the arguments surrounding Helguson have all been forgotten

Football is a funny old game

I wouldn't be blaming Warnock if Leon Clarke gamble did not pay off

The problem I had pre Warnock was that the manager wasn't buying the players. TBH I'm not bothered who it was beit Paladini, Briatore or anyone else not in the manager's role. A manager IMO should be the only person who brings players to the club as only he will really understand what the team lacks. If a manager asks his board to buy player x for whatever money and whatever contract then I and many others should be prepared to trust the manager - especially someone of Warnock's calibre.

However when someone without the experience or knowledge of a football manager goes ahead and brings in player after player then no wonder these kind of debates still arise because it will take many more seasons for the mess to be cleared. I questioned the length of the players contracts and the kinds of players we were signing because it was clear that De Canio wasn't making the decisions.

[northkenexile]

don't normally agree with Ric-Roc - but on this occassion i agree Vine is milking us but hardly his fault - we've given him a lucrative contract and i suppose he's entitled to the money - but shouldn't go sniping - bite the hand that feeds etc - i like most R's fans indeed most football fans - only want 100% / purely committed to the cause guys - so as Ric-Roc say's let him rot in "The Joey Squad" or fight his way back into contention

[baz]

Clearly he is training with the youth for refusing to go out on loan, however I'm sure the man has pride and he feels singled out, surely it would be better for all concerned if vine went to see Warnock asked to try and get his career back on track, trained with the first team and took the first half decent loan offered, you never know players have come back from this sort of thing. I don't think the guy is all about the money but he is certainly angry at what has happened to his career and what he see's as the injustice of how he is being treated. He probably needs a half decent advisor not out for the buck to guide him properly