Ilias Chair jailed?

[WeAreQPR12]

Topper does have a point. Ok innocent before proven guilty but some of you talking about slipping a few quid in the pocket of a man that has suffered brain injuries is way too flippant and a conversation that I feel uncomfortable with.

[SheepRanger]

You know what, if he did this, which seems to not be under question, f**k him. We all get into situations every now and then but we don't use rocks to bash peoples head in over nothing. It's not a home invader or someone threatening his kids. There's no excuse for this kind of behaviour and i hope he faces the full extent of the law, if true.

No smoke without fire and the fact 2 others are implicated seems to indicate there's an excessive use of force against this guy. It's not like he's lamped someone in a nightclub, this is different.

We don't need him to stay up, if all this comes to light as fact we should have bitten that Turkish sides hand off.

The French police didn't think there was a case to answer though. Someone's on the make. If it's a civil matter, as suggested, I just don't understand where the jail term came from.

Something happened, but Chair denies is was him. Someone's on the make!!

[DJ Hooper W12]

You know what, if he did this, which seems to not be under question, f**k him. We all get into situations every now and then but we don't use rocks to bash peoples head in over nothing. It's not a home invader or someone threatening his kids. There's no excuse for this kind of behaviour and i hope he faces the full extent of the law, if true.

No smoke without fire and the fact 2 others are implicated seems to indicate there's an excessive use of force against this guy. It's not like he's lamped someone in a nightclub, this is different.

We don't need him to stay up, if all this comes to light as fact we should have bitten that Turkish sides hand off.

Agree totally some of these footballers think they are above the law. Although strangely the last punch by one of these brave chappies l saw thrown on the pitch was Roy Keane. Mind you different gravy there
we can win without him today and stay up

[Abseits]

The French police didn't think there was a case to answer though. Someone's on the make. If it's a civil matter, as suggested, I just don't understand where the jail term came from.

Something happened, but Chair denies is was him. Someone's on the make!!

It's not a civil matter. It's normal in Belgian courts to deal with civil damages as part of the criminal proceedings. The simple fact is this: Chair has been convicted in court and sentenced. There is an avenue of appeal to both sides. The appeal can relate to the verdict OR the sentence or both. The other guy can appeal too (and the amount of damages does seem laughably small given the apparent extent of his injuries and suffering). Maybe there's more to this that mitigates things for Chair but as it stands, I can't see the point in being glib or trying to trivialise this VERY sordid and concerning incident.
If there was ever a time to " smooth" this thing over with a brown paper bag of cash it was ages ago and whatever happens now, it does seem extremely remiss of Chair, his agent and the club to not head this off at some point in the past couple of years.

[SheepRanger]

It's not a civil matter. It's normal in Belgian courts to deal with civil damages as part of the criminal proceedings. The simple fact is this: Chair has been convicted in court and sentenced. There is an avenue of appeal to both sides. The appeal can relate to the verdict OR the sentence or both. The other guy can appeal too (and the amount of damages does seem laughably small given the apparent extent of his injuries and suffering). Maybe there's more to this that mitigates things for Chair but as it stands, I can't see the point in being glib or trying to trivialise this VERY sordid and concerning incident.
If there was ever a time to " smooth" this thing over with a brown paper bag of cash it was ages ago and whatever happens now, it does seem extremely remiss of Chair, his agent and the club to not head this off at some point in the past couple of years.

All quite true, but perhaps he didnt feel the need to smooth it over in the past because he didnt do anything wrong? His defence was he didnt do ut. The club stated they have been in contact with his legal team in the past so must have been happy with his approach to the case.

It seems odd that the incident happened in France, but there's no persecution in France. That says a lot to me around the seriousness of this issue.

His legal team and the club were happy to deal with this by way of a written statenent initially. He wouldnt hsve been allowed to do that in this country if he was up for GBH. Again, it says a lot about the seriousness of the case.

This is all very odd and the lack of action by the French, his defence thst he didnt do it and his initial legal advice to deal with his by a written statement lead me to think this is on the lower end of severity and a 12 month detention is disproportionate.

That's my take from limited information out there. Time will tell.......

[shaggy24]

All quite true, but perhaps he didnt feel the need to smooth it over in the past because he didnt do anything wrong? His defence was he didnt do ut. The club stated they have been in contact with his legal team in the past so must have been happy with his approach to the case.

It seems odd that the incident happened in France, but there's no persecution in France. That says a lot to me around the seriousness of this issue.

His legal team and the club were happy to deal with this by way of a written statenent initially. He wouldnt hsve been allowed to do that in this country if he was up for GBH. Again, it says a lot about the seriousness of the case.

This is all very odd and the lack of action by the French, his defence thst he didnt do it and his initial legal advice to deal with his by a written statement lead me to think this is on the lower end of severity and a 12 month detention is disproportionate.

That's my take from limited information out there. Time will tell.......

Perhaps the French didn't do anything as they can't be f kin arsed and we're on strike moaning about air traffic control being on strike again british fisherman or blowing up dingies for immigrants to chance their arm crossing the channel.

[Sleeping Giants]

Forgetting about the moral aspect of what he may or may not have done, what gives a Belgian court the jurisdiction to jail a Moroccan individual for something that happened in France? I get that the victim is Belgian but that's not how it usually works is it? You're usually subject to the law of the land where you are at any given time.

[SheepRanger]

Perhaps the French didn't do anything as they can't be f kin arsed and we're on strike moaning about air traffic control being on strike again british fisherman or blowing up dingies for immigrants to chance their arm crossing the channel.

Too right.
More problems with the Gilly Johns.

[Abseits]

All quite true, but perhaps he didnt feel the need to smooth it over in the past because he didnt do anything wrong? His defence was he didnt do ut. The club stated they have been in contact with his legal team in the past so must have been happy with his approach to the case.

It seems odd that the incident happened in France, but there's no persecution in France. That says a lot to me around the seriousness of this issue.

His legal team and the club were happy to deal with this by way of a written statenent initially. He wouldnt hsve been allowed to do that in this country if he was up for GBH. Again, it says a lot about the seriousness of the case.

This is all very odd and the lack of action by the French, his defence thst he didnt do it and his initial legal advice to deal with his by a written statement lead me to think this is on the lower end of severity and a 12 month detention is disproportionate.

That's my take from limited information out there. Time will tell.......

C'mon Sheep - saying "it wasn't me" is hardly a defence is it? It's just standard response of virtually every defendant. I don't understand why you'd attribute any weight to that aspect of things. A credible defence would revolve around evidence he was elsewhere or uninvolved, preferably corroborated by others - don't seem he can conjure that sort of defence up though.

[Sleeping Giants]

C'mon Sheep - saying "it wasn't me" is hardly a defence is it? It's just standard response of virtually every defendant. I don't understand why you'd attribute any weight to that aspect of things. A credible defence would revolve around evidence he was elsewhere or uninvolved, preferably corroborated by others - don't seem he can conjure that sort of defence up though.

He was clearly there but he says it wasn't him that did it. People say "It wasn't me" for 2 reasons, 1 is that they are not telling the truth, the other is that it wasn't them that did it. None of us know what exactly happened.

[topperharley]

I hope he didn't do it, I hope he was being a model citizen and not any part of it, maybe someone smelled pro footballer and is on the blag.

[Sleeping Giants]

Forgetting about the moral aspect of what he may or may not have done, what gives a Belgian court the jurisdiction to jail a Moroccan individual for something that happened in France? I get that the victim is Belgian but that's not how it usually works is it? You're usually subject to the law of the land where you are at any given time.

Does anyone know the answer here? Why does a Belgian court have jurisdiction in this matter from a criminal justice point of view?

[ragr]

I wonder then whether there’s an EU angle to the civil side of things. That is pure speculation, I couldn’t be less of an expert.

[Abseits]

Does anyone know the answer here? Why does a Belgian court have jurisdiction in this matter from a criminal justice point of view?

You can't think in those terms, they use a different system/approach. Loosely comparing them to us: they do NOT separate criminal and civil for anything other than very serious offences. Everything else goes to a Court of three judges (no jury) who dish out a sentence AND compo. Trying to explain it ot view it in British Justice terms is futile and pointless.

As for jurisdiction, christ knows.... presume victim and/or Chair hold Belgian citizenship?

Frankly, given its relative sensational angle, I'm surprised a journalist hasn't done some proper digging and reporting here. Surely an editor somewhere would pay for a researched and factually accurate account of things? Maybe it'll happen tomorrow when working week starts.

[Sleeping Giants]

You can't think in those terms, they use a different system/approach. Loosely comparing them to us: they do NOT separate criminal and civil for anything other than very serious offences. Everything else goes to a Court of three judges (no jury) who dish out a sentence AND compo. Trying to explain it ot view it in British Justice terms is futile and pointless.

As for jurisdiction, christ knows.... presume victim and/or Chair hold Belgian citizenship?

Frankly, given its relative sensational angle, I'm surprised a journalist hasn't done some proper digging and reporting here. Surely an editor somewhere would pay for a researched and factually accurate account of things? Maybe it'll happen tomorrow when working week starts.

Yes, more will come out I suppose. He was born in Belgium, I didn't know this previously. I think that gives them jurisdiction. Cheers for reply.