Ollie and wing backs

[cheeseburgers]

Hi all, been reading the boards for a while now and posted a couple times but thought I'd make a thread to properly say hello.

I've been wondering lately if Ollie has a history with preferring wing backs. I just can't make sense of why he keeps picking them instead of using our wingers actually as wingers when its clearly not working well. Does anyone know if this is something he's always had a preference for, at other clubs or during his first spell managing us? Or is this some new innovation he keeps sticking to? Find it mind boggling seeing as we've no one suited for the position and have some proper wingers in the squad

Regardless pleased with the result today, watched over in Canada on the stream and was pleased with the entire effort. Delighted for Smyth, thought his strike was great and his general play and pace, hope he doesn't turn out to be another Tom Hitchcock!

[Pinkie]

Hi all, been reading the boards for a while now and posted a couple times but thought I'd make a thread to properly say hello.

I've been wondering lately if Ollie has a history with preferring wing backs. I just can't make sense of why he keeps picking them instead of using our wingers actually as wingers when its clearly not working well. Does anyone know if this is something he's always had a preference for, at other clubs or during his first spell managing us? Or is this some new innovation he keeps sticking to? Find it mind boggling seeing as we've no one suited for the position and have some proper wingers in the squad

Regardless pleased with the result today, watched over in Canada on the stream and was pleased with the entire effort. Delighted for Smyth, thought his strike was great and his general play and pace, hope he doesn't turn out to be another Tom Hitchcock!

Its a trend cheese, they all seem to use them these days, probably scared of losing and hoping to gain more possesion

[cheeseburgers]

That was my guess Pinkie. I think I'd almost be more forgiving about it if this was something he'd always insisted on and had stuck with through different clubs instead of it just being the cool thing to do the past few seasons.

[Tarbie]

Like Pinkie says, it's fashionable at the moment isn't it? Ollie probably sees Gaurdiola doing it at City and thinks it's the way to go.

For me, it's not my preferred system. And it certainly doesn't work well unless you have players that suit the system. I think our centre halves have just about got is sussed now, but we really don't have anyone in the squad (aside from perhaps Furlong) who I feel naturally fits the wing back position. Wing back is not an easy role, you need to be fit, quick and comfortable attacking and defending. For these reasons, I don't think it's best attempted with a squad like ours.

[Pinkie]

Like Pinkie says, it's fashionable at the moment isn't it? Ollie probably sees Gaurdiola doing it at City and thinks it's the way to go.

For me, it's not my preferred system. And it certainly doesn't work well unless you have players that suit the system. I think our centre halves have just about got is sussed now, but we really don't have anyone in the squad (aside from perhaps Furlong) who I feel naturally fits the wing back position. Wing back is not an easy role, you need to be fit, quick and comfortable attacking and defending. For these reasons, I don't think it's best attempted with a squad like ours.

Obviously goes alot further back but didnt chelsea win the champions league playing like it? and didnt it all change from barcelona doing it with all midfielders! cant quite remember, but im like you tarbs, brought up seeing strike partnerships and copying them when a kid and techniques football should be about flair and wingers and flair in midfield and upfront duos

[nasser95]

I love the formation but hate it for our current crop of players. I totally understand its appeals but we need the right player for it. I mean, even Guardiola dropped it as soon as he lost one player he bought specifically for the role (Ben Mendy at LWB) so you'd hope Ollie would have done the same but he hasn't and I don't get why. We talk about the need for a striker but we really need full/wing backs

[Tarbie]

Obviously goes alot further back but didnt chelsea win the champions league playing like it? and didnt it all change from barcelona doing it with all midfielders! cant quite remember, but im like you tarbs, brought up seeing strike partnerships and copying them when a kid and techniques football should be about flair and wingers and flair in midfield and upfront duos

Wing backs have been around forever mate. Hoddle used to play with them when he was England Manager as well as Chelsea under Ruud Gullit. It's had resurgence in the last few seasons though, hasn't it?

[cheeseburgers]

I feel like wing backs only ever work if you've got top players who can specialize in the position... seems to be one of the worst positions for square pegs/round holes I find

[gator]

I feel like wing backs only ever work if you've got top players who can specialize in the position... seems to be one of the worst positions for square pegs/round holes I find

If you're from Canada cheese you must know that Ollie stole this system from that football genious at Toronto FC, Greg Vanney!

[Pinkie]

Wing backs have been around forever mate. Hoddle used to play with them when he was England Manager as well as Chelsea under Ruud Gullit. It's had resurgence in the last few seasons though, hasn't it?

Ah yes youre right tarbs, forgot about ruud and hoddle, and we looked really good under hoddle for a short spell before he left, the fa should never have let him go

[cheeseburgers]

I've only been to one TFC match since I moved to Toronto a few years ago (have to say I prefer the league of ireland, used to go to that frequently) might keep an eye out for that next season then as it seems to actually be working for them

[gator]

I've only been to one TFC match since I moved to Toronto a few years ago (have to say I prefer the league of ireland, used to go to that frequently) might keep an eye out for that next season then as it seems to actually be working for them

I was mostly kidding with that comment although that system works quite well for them as they have the proper players to do it, I prefer the Championship over MLS any day!

[corbray]

wing backs for us do my nut in, we simply don't have the players for it and more often than not we suffer coz of it! bidwell, cousins, pavel, wheeler etc are not wingbacks and they won't ever be. play our team to its strengths, bidwell as a lb in a back 4 and pavel as a right winger or on the right of a front 3. its not rocket science

[Abseits]

I think Olly's approach is based on fact our flat back 4 is quite porous, error prone and unable to keep a clean sheet. He therefore plays 5 at the back on the basis it must make us 25% better in defence..... I don't think he sees it as an adventurous approach or a wingback thing at all. It's just more defenders on the pitch to him.
I reckon the fundamental problem is most of our defenders are at best average so fiddling about with formations is like rearranging the deck chairs on the SS Titanic.
I would rather just stick to 4-4-2 and not fanny about with esoteric set ups our players are not equipped to handle..... drill them to death for several hours a day in 4-4-2 and don't confuse them.

[Bluehoop]

I think Olly's approach is based on fact our flat back 4 is quite porous, error prone and unable to keep a clean sheet. He therefore plays 5 at the back on the basis it must make us 25% better in defence..... I don't think he sees it as an adventurous approach or a wingback thing at all. It's just more defenders on the pitch to him.
I reckon the fundamental problem is most of our defenders are at best average so fiddling about with formations is like rearranging the deck chairs on the SS Titanic.
I would rather just stick to 4-4-2 and not fanny about with esoteric set ups our players are not equipped to handle..... drill them to death for several hours a day in 4-4-2 and don't confuse them.

Your post is spot on until the very last sentence. I do this stuff every week and have a whole heap of badges to prove it. But the courses teach you nothing about the beast you are coaching and the truth is you "drill them to death", so to speak, at your peril. It is the thing that confuses these guys the most. They are not delicate learning machines, they are thick jack cloths with the concentration levels of the average single celled amoeba