No Chery, no Luongo. Three points.

[dogsrrs]

Personally disagree vehemently about Luongo and think that the absence of these 2 players had naff all to do with our win today. Wolves battered us from start to finish. Imo it was the CB pairing of Lynch and Hall with no Nedum that did it.

Agreed Ginge didn't go but I seem to think players like Hall and Lynch will give you grit where it matters and can battle it out when your'e under the cosh , and have always looked on Luongo as a player that catches the eye when he's at the game but also I see him as a show pony that goes absent too often for to long not giving enough cover to his back 4

[amusant]

Impossible to draw any conclusion from one win. On the play today, we deserved to lose, but then again I thought we were very unlucky to come away from the Derby and Villa games with nothing. We're a bottom half of the table side with few outstanding talents and will struggle whoever manages us.

[nasser95]

It's interesting because your adamant he's a defensive midfielder Nas and he's great at that role I see him more advanced then that and more a box to box midfielder and think his best position would be where Chery has been wasted

I have not seen him playing the holding role this season so to suggest he has been I can only assume your doing so to defend his stats which I would say on attacking grounds are appalling

I say he's basically a Diakite style player with better awareness and tackling talent. On the ball he just breezes past players with ease and when he's chasing down an attacker, he generally manages to catch up and make a solid tackle.

If you see a player having a different role to what he ends up actually doing, perhaps it's because you've set expectations on the player that are different to what he can actually do. Think of when Chelsea signed makelele and Madrid staff and fans were adamant that he would not be missed. Just look at what club president Perez said about him:

We will not miss Makélelé. His technique is average, he lacks the speed and skill to take the ball past opponents, and ninety percent of his distribution either goes backwards or sideways. He wasn't a header of the ball and he rarely passed the ball more than three metres. Younger players will arrive who will cause Makélelé to be forgotten.

The players themselves knew his value as an engine but because the owner wanted a different sort of player, they got rid of someone who they've had a ridiculously hard time replacing.

What we should be doing with Luongo (and others) is looking at what they excel at and putting them in a position to play that role better. Putting him in attacking midfield is just a way to not take advantage of what he brings. You look at what your players are good at technically and you coach them to understand the role better. That means making Luongo a full on defensive midfielder with licence to run with the ball, telling Chery "you play lots of passes that lead to goalscoring chances, so stop running back and stay in the hole where you can do that more", telling Onuoha "you're at your best when you're covering the lack of pace your partner has don't push up ahead of him, stay in line and cover". Things like that get the best out of the players. Then you build a style and decide what sort of player you want in each role and sign or release based on what each player brings to fit the exact role you want them to.

[72bus]

i see mass do well in flashes but that's it , thought he was great at fulham away but has done nothing since .he gets knocked off the ball to often , runs into players and runs out of ideas , not seen him really impose himself to any great degree to be called a future PL player

[1cliveallen]

He's been set as an attacking midfielder once this season so I really don't know what you're on about at first. He's a defensive midfielder. It's that simple. Defensively, he's brilliant at this level and he Will be a very good premier league midfielder in his prime. It's a shame there are people who don't rate him here and will go out of their way to bury his confidence with ridiculous threads just to ensure that - like Matt Phillips and Leroy Fer - he will go on to a better team and succeed there.

I played golf with his agent who told me he is NOT a defensive midfielder and feels shackled in that position. He describes him as a poor mans gazza who likes to attack defenders with mazy little runs at hthe heart of the defence. Now who or what should I believe? My own eyes, the view of the player himself, the view of the agent who played in all 4 divisions and manages the dealings of 27 players including grant hall or the view of someone who I personally don't believe has played football on anything other than a computer.

[corbray]

Mass doesn't play best as a holding midfielder and was forced to adapt to that role by jfh and imo he has had flashes of doing well. For australia hes more of an attacking midfielder who causes lots of problems as cliveallen said, hes more of a poor mans gazza. He does get bullied off the ball a lot but imo needs the same creative freedom that was given to chery as imo mass is better than him and with more desire and with the right players around him would be an absolute force for us

[West Acton]

Can't agree with simply badging him as a defensive midfielder. If he can do that aspect of the game and also carry ball and create he's an all round midfielder why shackle him as a defensive one. Let him do what he can do all over the pitch surely using him that way is actually getting the most and best out of him which will benefit us and him more

[Rangers77]

Whatever he is he's been pure and utter pants for us up to now. Caulker has scored more goals than him. Me, sitting in the Ellerslie, have scored the same as him.

[Hertford Hoop]

Change a winning team? Not for me

[nasser95]

Whatever he is he's been pure and utter pants for us up to now. Caulker has scored more goals than him. Me, sitting in the Ellerslie, have scored the same as him.

It's a striker's job to score goals. Some of the best midfielders in the game barely scored.

[James1979]

It's a striker's job to score goals. Some of the best midfielders in the game barely scored.

Rubbish. Well he could at least set up some goals then

[WeAreQPR12]

It's a striker's job to score goals. Some of the best midfielders in the game barely scored.

Your stats mean sod all. Ali had the worst pass % and the least amount of touches on the ball yet just scored 2 goals v Watford and helped win the game

[nasser95]

Rubbish. Well he could at least set up some goals then

Again, he's being played as a deep midfielder, the primary role belongs to those in front of him. Chery, the wingers and the strikers are the ones who the burden of goalscoring and assisting should fall on, but because they aren't doing that, people will scapegoat everyone else and unfortunately, Mass is a target for scapegoating.

[West Acton]

Ok then why is Chery not doing the business if he's playing that role

[nasser95]

Your stats mean sod all. Ali had the worst pass % and the least amount of touches on the ball yet just scored 2 goals v Watford and helped win the game

You are talking about two different players. Two players who have different styles and are expected to do different things. You can't seriously be comparing Luongo and Alli as players? Dele Alli made 1 tackle, didn't win anything in the air and didn't intercept anything. Meanwhile, Luongo averages 3.7 tackles per game, 1.1 interceptions per game and 2.7 aerial duel wins per game. He gives us a chance to win by doing his job.

Dele Allie is an attacking midfielder who just needs to have the final touch in a move to do something, but doesn't get involved in the defensive side of the game.

Luongo is being used as a defensive midfielder who needs to win the ball back and either run with the ball or play it to one of the front 4 to do the job.

Once again, I use the makelele comparison, Makelele almost never played a forward ball, never looked to get into the box, never looked to do that stuff, but he won his teams matches by screening the defense. How foolish would you look using the comparison above with Alli to Makelele?